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> 4-Wide Guide, library of knowledge regarding 4-wide combos
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xbxcv
post Dec 5 2011, 08:53 AM
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QUOTE(jkwon23 @ Dec 4 2011, 11:40 AM) *

Try stacking flat. After looking at your previews, go for the form that will least likely get you stuck. Study some 4 wide stacking patterns on the wiki so you can get an idea. Also remember that there must be 3 units in the middle for the combo to initiate. You can use any piece for the starter as long as there are 3 units or + 4n units in the 4 wide gap (n = number of tetris blocks) because 4 units are bound to be cleared away.
Here are some videos that might help with your 4w:
http://harddrop.com/videos/id_512/title_21-combo-into-a-pc/
http://harddrop.com/videos/id_369/title_re...an-of-miracles/
http://harddrop.com/videos/id_371/title_nu...mino-100-lines/

what do u mean when stacking flat sorry newb here
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xbxcv
post Dec 5 2011, 08:53 AM
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QUOTE(jkwon23 @ Dec 4 2011, 11:40 AM) *

Try stacking flat. After looking at your previews, go for the form that will least likely get you stuck. Study some 4 wide stacking patterns on the wiki so you can get an idea. Also remember that there must be 3 units in the middle for the combo to initiate. You can use any piece for the starter as long as there are 3 units or + 4n units in the 4 wide gap (n = number of tetris blocks) because 4 units are bound to be cleared away.
Here are some videos that might help with your 4w:
http://harddrop.com/videos/id_512/title_21-combo-into-a-pc/
http://harddrop.com/videos/id_369/title_re...an-of-miracles/
http://harddrop.com/videos/id_371/title_nu...mino-100-lines/

what do u mean when stacking flat sorry newb here
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jkwon23
post Dec 9 2011, 01:48 AM
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try to balance your stack
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xbxcv
post Dec 9 2011, 09:59 AM
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i can stack well with side but not with mid Frown.png hahaha.. i guees ill use side
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jkwon23
post Dec 10 2011, 05:56 AM
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no pain, no gain.
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Profane
post Dec 10 2011, 06:38 AM
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So i've never really heard the non combo strategy to breaking a combo starter. Usually i just do my normal opening try to stay low and hold an I piece to try to send lines back. any tips?


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XaeL
post Dec 10 2011, 07:16 AM
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QUOTE(Profane @ Dec 10 2011, 06:38 AM) *

So i've never really heard the non combo strategy to breaking a combo starter. Usually i just do my normal opening try to stay low and hold an I piece to try to send lines back. any tips?

combos are stronger.. dont expect to beat a combo without a combo.


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QUOTE(Paradox @ Dec 16 2010 @ 05:52 PM)
Like many setups here, it is useful if your opponent doesn't move and you get 4 Ts in a row.
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caffeine
post Dec 10 2011, 05:49 PM
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QUOTE(Profane @ Dec 10 2011, 12:38 AM) *

So i've never really heard the non combo strategy to breaking a combo starter. Usually i just do my normal opening try to stay low and hold an I piece to try to send lines back. any tips?

It's interesting you said this. I've been thinking about it, and it seems like there's a sort of rock/paper/scissors strategy when countering 4 wide openings. For example, I was playing against this one guy last month. I do middle 4 wide and win a couple games. Then, he catches on and starts doing a side 4 wide. This is a safe counter. Since I won't be starting my combo for a while, he'll have time to stack his side 4 wide without me topping him out. And... he'll be able to stack that 4 wide faster than my middle 4 wide, since it's easier and more straight forward. So, after I caught on to that, I started watching to see if he was going to do a side 4 wide. When he did, I'd build up a perfect clear. I'd wait for him to get closer to the top, and then I'd do the PC. It was kind of funny to watch: instant KO every time. This happened a few times, and then he went back to opening with T-Spins, and I went back to middle 4 wide.
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Chopin
post Dec 10 2011, 08:01 PM
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QUOTE(caffeine @ Dec 10 2011, 05:49 PM) *

So, after I caught on to that, I started watching to see if he was going to do a side 4 wide. When he did, I'd build up a perfect clear. I'd wait for him to get closer to the top, and then I'd do the PC. It was kind of funny to watch: instant KO every time. This happened a few times, and then he went back to opening with T-Spins, and I went back to middle 4 wide.

This stopped working really when people learned how to do PCs Sticking Out Tongue.png
And with E+, the opponent can just start their combo, 10 lines is not that much, and also any slightly decent player will notice if you're sitting there with a PC for 20 seconds lol. I would out wait you, absorb it all, and you are gg ^_^
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caffeine
post Dec 10 2011, 08:46 PM
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QUOTE(Chopin @ Dec 10 2011, 02:01 PM) *

This stopped working really when people learned how to do PCs Sticking Out Tongue.png
And with E+, the opponent can just start their combo, 10 lines is not that much, and also any slightly decent player will notice if you're sitting there with a PC for 20 seconds lol. I would out wait you, absorb it all, and you are gg ^_^

"This stopped working"... are you referring to countering side 4w with a PC? For it not to work, then the 4w'er would have to stop before he gets 10 rows high. If he starts a combo at only 10 rows high, that's not very threatening. So what I'd think would happen is: if he sees that I'm going to do the PC and doesn't stack up, then I do the PC anyway and wait. He won't send that much from the 10-row combo, so that will be easy to get through. When he gets to the PC garbage, that will be easy enough to clear. I'd think so, anyway. If I overstacked, then I could definitely see that as bad news. But I guess I'd have to see for myself in a real game.

Edit: on second thought, you might have something there. I need to play this scenerio out a few times.
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xbxcv
post Dec 18 2011, 02:04 AM
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what do u think is the best counter of 4 wide?
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post Dec 18 2011, 04:33 AM
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QUOTE(xbxcv @ Dec 18 2011, 02:04 AM) *

what do u think is the best counter of 4 wide?


Early pressure, don't allow them to stack their 4 wide enough for it to be a big threat.
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dispo_io
post Dec 18 2011, 06:19 AM
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QUOTE(Barneey @ Dec 17 2011, 11:33 PM) *

Early pressure, don't allow them to stack their 4 wide enough for it to be a big threat.


I think tspins should do it, but you have to be consistent and not break b2b bonus.
I think it takes 7 tetriminos to make 4 combo, 14 tetriminos to make 8 combo and so on ...
You get a t tetrimino every 7 tetriminos or so, so you should be able to do t-spin doubles.

Low tpm differential case:
First 7 blocks:
combo potential added = 4, lines sent by spinner = 4, remaining height in 4wide matrix = 12
Next 7 blocks
combo potential added = 4, lines sent by spinner = 5, remaining height in 4 wide matrix = 3
only 2 of the remaining rows can be filled by 4wider

At this point, 4wider will probably start combo. Combo potential from built up 4wide should be about 8-11 (depending on where garbage hole is for 4wider)
Lines sent from 8-11 combo is 13-25 I believe. But it also takes 8 tetriminos to do 8 combo, which allows for another t-spin sending 6 lines. By the end of this, you will be somewhere in the top half of the matrix with easy to downstack garbage (becase garbage hole changes less for higher combos).

Thats a hypothetical scenario and assumes E+ settings. but i hope u see that its possible to survive 4wide. Some mitigating factors: 4widers confidence and DAS level, the t-spin setup u use (t-spin triples and doubles), whether its a centre or a side 4w, 4w style (3x starting minos in gap vs hole-less start).
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xbxcv
post Jan 5 2012, 09:04 AM
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w/c is much better 4 wide or 3 wide?
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coolmaninsano
post Jan 5 2012, 09:38 AM
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QUOTE(xbxcv @ Jan 5 2012, 01:04 AM) *
w/c is much better 4 wide or 3 wide?
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